List Archives

Wed Dec 8 04:37:08 GMT 2010

"Which
is why a pilot can not fly for at least 4 hours after a single beer"

I believe it's eight hours actually.  The adage I was taught as a student
pilot is "eight hours, bottle to throttle."

On Tue, Dec 7, 2010 at 11:05 PM, John Francis <surjohn at gmail.com> wrote:

> Interesting point.
>
> But I'm afraid you may be mixing metaphors (or examples as the case may
> be).
> Multi-tasking is a learned skill, complete sobriety is not.
> Some people may be able to text and drive quite safely (not sure I'd like
> to
> volunteer for the test case) dependent on skills. A beer in hand is
> probably
> quite low on the multi-tasking aspect, but then you could have said a can
> in
> hand, or something similar. If you were suggesting that imbibing from the
> beer in hand is less distracting than that is a different story. "Drunk" is
> a purely political term and designation depending on who is measuring.
> Which
> is why a pilot can not fly for at least 4 hours after a single beer, no
> matter how skilled they are at multi-tasking. The results of alcohol on
> thinking/reacting may appear similar to being distracted - but the reason
> is
> entirely different.
> Having a beer in hand is a good comparison to being distracted. Having a
> beer in hand and drinking from it is an entirely different matter.
> Just my two cents :)
> John
>
>
> On Tue, Dec 7, 2010 at 8:48 AM, Bjorn, Pret <pbjorn at emh.org> wrote:
>
> > Maybe this will come as a shocker, but I'm not unconditionally alarmed
> > by an open beer in a driver's hand.  It's offensive, I agree, and you
> > won't catch me with one; but objectively, this issue is more one of
> > principle than substance.
> >
> > A single beer, after all, is less demanding and distracting than a smart
> > phone.  Or even a standard cell phone.  Or, for that matter, a double
> > Quarter-Pounder with the works: a bottle of beer is, if nothing else,
> > less apt to expel a mess of condiments into my lap as I'm approaching an
> > important turn.
> >
> > All that being said, I see nothing unreasonable about an open bottle
> > constituting probable cause for a spot sobriety test and amplified
> > penalties.  Indeed, such conditions may help to IDENTIFY high-risk
> > drivers for prosecution.
> >
> > Just saying.
> >
> > Pret
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: trauma-list-bounces at trauma.org
> > [mailto:trauma-list-bounces at trauma.org] On Behalf Of Jel Coward
> > Sent: Monday, December 06, 2010 9:45 PM
> > To: Trauma-List [TRAUMA.ORG <http://trauma.org/>]
> > Subject: Re: A drunk driving video from Australia-- that MADE a
> > difference
> >
> > On 6 December 2010 05:05, Bjorn, Pret <pbjorn at emh.org> wrote:
> >
> > >
> > >
> > > Looks to me as if Victoria is undergoing a CULTURAL change.  Such is,
> > by
> > > definition, multifactorial, multidimensional, and complex.  But the
> > > underlying individual drivers are not nearly as important as their
> > > synergy.
> > >
> >
> >
> > Really enjoying this discussion - thanks to all.
> >
> > On moving to Canada (British Columbia) in 2001, after an initial setting
> > in
> > period, as I got to know folks and make friends.....I became _horrified_
> > at
> > the social acceptability of drinking and driving.
> >
> > Friends I respect in many ways would get behind the wheel _with beer
> > still
> > in hand_.
> >
> > A story told to me by a new (in the area) police officer was that when
> > he
> > stopped someone along a particular part of a rural road, the driver
> > expressed dismay and surprise, because in the past there had been an
> > unspoken agreement with a previous lead officer that 'once on this
> > (particular) road, it was ok to open up the beer'.
> >
> > A friend out  here from the UK in 2003, would hitch a ride from a town
> > 35
> > kms away (where she was working)......I was worried for her
> > safety.....but
> > even more so when she told me that the figure was about 50 percent for
> > the
> > number of drivers who would pick her up, who had an open beer.
> >
> > 3 years ago, by April, in this low population rural area, we had 9 young
> > people dead from alcohol and driving.  If they had been firearms deaths
> > there would have been an outcry (not a pro-firearm comment, by the way).
> >
> > ...and I think it was about 5 years ago when Gordon Campbell, Premier of
> > BC,
> > was arrested for drunk driving in Hawaii......and from the video, one
> > would
> > assume, not just a little bit drunk.  The folks he was visiting were
> > said to
> > have advised him against driving.   He did not resign.   The Canadian
> > press
> > barely squeeked out a bark at him.    Even as I type this now, I can't
> > believe that it is true.  would
> >
> > The notion that this is 'cultural' is correct.   The 'culture' needs to
> > be
> > changed.  Cultural change is multi-factorial.....and some might say that
> > it
> > should start at the top, with our leaders behaving in appropriate ways.
> >
> >
> > When I left the UK, of course drink driving was (is) a problem there
> > too....but.....a change had taken place.......it had become socially
> > unacceptable to do it......drink drivers were castigated by society -
> > friends would not allow friends to drive home from the pub (or would
> > call
> > the police).
> > Along with this were severe penalties - blow over the limit on the
> > roadside
> > intoximeter = licence gone for 12 months, no appeal, no extenuating
> > circumstances........one thing that came clear to police and the public
> > was
> > that the morning after a drinking session many folks would still be
> > 'over
> > the limit' and the police regularly breathalyze in the mornings.  I
> > _think_
> > it is now a requirement that the police breathalyze _everyone_ who is
> > involved in an MVC.
> > ....and if the Prime Minister was caught (on video that was made public)
> > swerving down the road because s/he was drunk.......they wouldn't last a
> > few
> > minutes before having to resign......the press would take care of that.
> >
> >
> > Recently BC laws were toughened - the allowed level of blood alcohol has
> > been reduced - police can impound a vehicle for 3 months based on a
> > roadside
> > test etc.  ........and what have we heard?.......politicians suggesting
> > that
> > the RCMP (police) need to be more lenient in their application of the
> > new
> > laws!!
> >
> >
> > Enough ranting from me.
> >
> > Have a safe evening.
> >
> > Jel
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
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> >
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-- 
Stephen Richey

"A man's moral worth is established only at the point where he is ready to
give up his life in defense of his convictions."- Henning von Tresckow

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A drunk driving video from Australia-- that MADE a difference