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Thu May 28 12:51:09 BST 2009

...and I never implied that my message was directed at you.  Just wanted
to clear up any misconceptions among those who wanted comments from
lawyers about enforcement of HEMS marketing to match that of drug reps.
There is no crime in either case.  Crass, clearly; bribery, not in the
least.

And in the interest of disclosure, I've eaten my share of pizza and
donuts, and grabbed up all manner of crash shears and calculators and
cool pens, all the while griping at the cost of prescriptions.

But that's a whole other thread on a whole other list-server.

Pret

-----Original Message-----
From: trauma-list-bounces at trauma.org
[mailto:trauma-list-bounces at trauma.org] On Behalf Of Andrew J Bowman
Sent: Thursday, May 28, 2009 7:30 AM
To: Trauma-List [TRAUMA.ORG]
Cc: Trauma-List [TRAUMA.ORG]
Subject: Re: Traumatic rescue caught on TV

Never implied it was criminal. Just suggested that many HEMS agencies  
offer trinkets and food so that ground EMS will call them, even when  
not indicated.

Typed by my index finger and sent from my iPhone.

Andrew J Bowman
Acute Care Nurse Practitioner
Trauma Nurse Specialist
Paramedic

Witham Health Services
Emergency Department
Lebanon, Indiana
765-485-8500 Work
765-426-4189 Cell
765-485-8509 Fax

On May 28, 2009, at 5:58, "Pret Bjorn" <p.bjorn at netzero.net> wrote:

> Since when (and where) are there laws prohibiting pizzas and fridge  
> magnets
> from drug reps -- or anybody else?
>
> Not that I'm a big proponent; but if this is a crime, I'm unaware of  
> it.
> And I expect that in the US, there are First Amendment implications.
>
> Pret
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: trauma-list-bounces at trauma.org
[mailto:trauma-list-bounces at trauma.org 
> ]
> On Behalf Of Stephen Richey
> Sent: Wednesday, May 27, 2009 4:20 PM
> To: Trauma &amp, Critical Care mailing list
> Subject: Re: Traumatic rescue caught on TV
>
> I don't believe so...perhaps one of our lawyers could comment.  it  
> should
> very well fall under the same requirements of the drug reps but I do  
> not
> believe it is enforced the same way.  Perhaps this would be another  
> tool in
> the battle to reign in these predatory companies while we wait for  
> the new
> FAA regulations that are due out in the next couple of years that will
> likely cut the throats of AEL and other companies that are strictly  
> profit
> driven even at the cost of lives.   Hopefully that will be the final  
> straw
> that forces HEMS to reinvent itself into something beneficial to the  
> few
> communities that truly need the use of a helicopter.
>
> I've always viewed the handing out of pizza, soda and trinkets to EMS
> providers as tantamount to low brow bribery and was looked  at as an  
> EMS
> equivalent of a Frank Serpico (not that I'm comparing myself to  
> Detective
> Serpico...one of my colleagues used to jokingly call me it whenever  
> this
> topic came up) for not taking part in any "educational" activities  
> sponsored
> by PHI, AEL or any of the other aeromedical operations and trying to
> convince others to do the same.   In fact, I have often wondered how  
> AEL's
> public "membership" "service" is legal in some states where ground  
> ambulance
> services are prohibited from such activities.
>
> On Wed, May 27, 2009 at 4:06 PM, Anthony Caruso  
> <medic541 at hotmail.com>wrote:
>
>> Stephen aren't there laws governing that kind of practice?  I would  
>> think
>> it also falls under the same laws that prohibit drug reps from  
>> doing the
>> same thing.
>> -----Original Message-----
>> From: Stephen Richey <stephen.richey at gmail.com>
>>
>> Date: Wed, 27 May 2009 20:00:04
>> To: <trauma-list at trauma.org>
>> Subject: Re: Traumatic rescue caught on TV
>>
>>
>> No, and Air Evac Lifeteam lost a crew last year (including a friend  
>> of
>> mine)
>> because of exactly that sort of behavior.
>>
>> On Wed, May 27, 2009 at 3:49 PM, Andrew J Bowman
>> <andrewj.bowman at gmail.com>wrote:
>>
>>> No I am not.
>>>
>>> Andrew
>>>
>>> On Wed, May 27, 2009 at 3:43 PM, Gross, Ronald <
>>> Ronald.Gross at baystatehealth.org> wrote:
>>>
>>>> He better say yes............
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> -----Original Message-----
>>>> From: trauma-list-bounces at trauma.org [mailto:
>>>> trauma-list-bounces at trauma.org] On Behalf Of kmattox at aol.com
>>>> Sent: Wednesday, May 27, 2009 3:33 PM
>>>> To: Trauma-List [TRAUMA.ORG <http://trauma.org/ <http:// 
>>>> trauma.org/>
>>> ]
>>>> Subject: Re: Traumatic rescue caught on TV
>>>>
>>>> U R joking.
>>>> ------Original Message------
>>>> From: Andrew J Bowman
>>>> Sender: trauma-list-bounces at trauma.org
>>>> To: Trauma-List [TRAUMA.ORG <http://trauma.org/ <http:// 
>>>> trauma.org/>
>>> ]
>>>> ReplyTo: Trauma-List [TRAUMA.ORG <http://trauma.org/ <
>> http://trauma.org/> >]
>>>> Sent: May 27, 2009 2:22 PM
>>>> Subject: Re: Traumatic rescue caught on TV
>>>>
>>>> Because they give us pizza and cool t-shirts when we call them.
>>>>
>>>> Andrew
>>>>
>>>> On Wed, May 27, 2009 at 3:12 PM, <kmattox at aol.com> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> Why the helicopter ?
>>>>>
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>>
>> --
>> Stephen Richey, CRT
>>
>> "It is not unreasonable that we grapple with problems....Our
>> responsibility
>> is to do what we can, learn what we can, improve the solutions, and  
>> pass
>> them on."- Richard Feynman
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>
>
>
> -- 
> Stephen Richey, CRT
>
> "It is not unreasonable that we grapple with problems....Our  
> responsibility
> is to do what we can, learn what we can, improve the solutions, and  
> pass
> them on."- Richard Feynman
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