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Thu May 7 11:49:20 BST 2009

You got 'em spot on!

Ron
-----Original Message-----
From: trauma-list-bounces at trauma.org [mailto:trauma-list-bounces at trauma.org] On Behalf Of Jose Luis Danguilan
Sent: Wednesday, May 06, 2009 4:24 PM
To: Trauma and Critical Care mailing list
Subject: Re: to Doc Holiday-DELAYED response

I fully agree with Dr. Gross. We seem to baby the new generation of surgical
residents. Hard work has never killed anyone. Fire makes steel strong in the
same way challenges toughen a person or did I get my metaphors mixed up?

A fellow triceratops,

Jose Luis J. Danguilan, MD
Manila, Philippines

On Wed, May 6, 2009 at 7:26 PM, Gross, Ronald <
Ronald.Gross at baystatehealth.org> wrote:

> And when you finally finish your truncated 5 year surgical residency, with
> protected educational time, sleep time and no more that 80 hours per week,
> and you have to go out into the REAL world, will your patients understand
> that you need to go home now 'cause you're sleepy, and someone they have
> never seen will be caring for them?
>
> Athletes learn endurance by working harder and longer in their workouts
> then they have to do in the "real deal".  Our stakes are FAR higher than any
> athletes' stakes, and yet we are failing to teach our residents the expanse
> of knowledge they will need, and we are failing to prepare them for the real
> world, where there isn't protected education time, and guaranteed sleep
> time.
>
> I know, my wife has told me on several occasions that I am a dinosaur.  She
> is probably right.....but this dinosaur has been true to his calling, and
> will never stop being fully responsible for the care of his patients - all
> the time!
>
> (OOPS, need to take a nap now.  Worked too long.........)
>
> Best to you all,
> Ron
>
>
>
> -----Original Message-----
> From: trauma-list-bounces at trauma.org [mailto:
> trauma-list-bounces at trauma.org] On Behalf Of khumar huseynova
> Sent: Tuesday, May 05, 2009 4:50 PM
> To: trauma-list at trauma.org
> Subject: to Doc Holiday-DELAYED response
>
> Dr Holiday, sorry for retarded response-just read your note on resident
> hours (March). Thanks and yes, you are right, there is evidence that long
> hours result in reduced effciency and eventual harm to the patient. I dont
> think I will ever agree witht eh 48hr/wk schedule for SURGERY residents-it
> has to be MORE than that. Am not saying 120hrs, but should be reasonable
> enough to get suffucuent experience and not to feel 'dead' at the end of the
> day. Maybe someone needs to design a study to determine the cutoff...
> And you are right, there are perhaps other ways of increasing the quality
> of residency without making the hours too long as well. The problem is,
> given how conservative the health care system is, it will take decades to
> change it.
> Cheers. KH
>
>
>
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