List Archives

Fri Jun 12 13:51:31 BST 2009

We all know if it is not matter is doesn't matter.  Except that I know that I and my matter are interconnected and yet "I" am not my matter.

Dan P Burgess RN MS CEN
Trauma Program Manager
Memorial Hospital at Gulfport
228-575-2079

Confidentiality Notice: This e-mail message, including any
attachments, is for the sole use of the intended recipient(s)
and may contain confidential and privileged information. 
Any unauthorized review, use, disclosure, or distribution is 
prohibited.  If you are not the intended recipient, please
contact the sender by reply e-mail and destroy all copies of 
the original message.

>>> "Gross, Ronald" <Ronald.Gross at baystatehealth.org> 6/12/2009 6:55 AM >>>
C'mon Fiona, I drink snake oil every day and I feel GREAT!!!  My tongue looks a bit weird, but everything else is OK...................

Ron

-----Original Message-----
From: trauma-list-bounces at trauma.org [mailto:trauma-list-bounces at trauma.org] On Behalf Of Fiona Wallace
Sent: Friday, June 12, 2009 4:27 AM
To: Trauma-List [TRAUMA.ORG]
Subject: Re: Alternative therapies (OT)

Oh, for goodness sake.

The plural of anecdote is not data.

It is well recognised that sticking needles in people has definite  
physiological effects, however it DOESN'T MATTER where you put the  
needles.

There is no such thing as 'life energy' except the stuff that comes  
out of defibrillator paddles (and then only when it works)

My prescription is for a year long course of Pharyngula, Skeptic's  
Guide to the Universe and Quackcast (Google them if you haven't come  
across them). Alternative 'medicine' is no different from any other  
sort in only one respect - it needs an EVIDENCE BASE and sound  
physiological underpinning before it's used in a clinical context.

/rant (but happy to continue the discussion elsewhere)

Fiona Wallace.

On 12/06/2009, at 5:32 PM, Lorick Fox, MPAS, PA-C wrote:

>
> We may want to be slow to totally scoff at some of these therapies.
> I must admit I generally (still) do, but:
>
> About 7 years ago I ended up doing an informal consult on an  
> Egyptian (in
> Cairo) with marked LV systolic dysfunction who had refused
> revascularization.  Despite having some really good cardiologists and
> cardiac surgeons in Egypt, somehow an "American opinion" was valued.  
> I ended
> up joining his family for dinner one night.
>
> At that dinner I met a Japanese practitioner (who spoke no English)  
> who was
> present because the family had flown him to Egypt from japan to use a
> "laying on of hands" therapy for a patient with ALS. He specialized  
> in care
> of neurological disorders and despite the language barrier, with
> translation, we had an interesting conversation.  I think I still  
> have his
> business card somewhere.
> Now, I did NOT see the patient with ALS, nor a medical record to  
> verify the
> diagnosis.  However, the family was well off (to put it mildly) and  
> the odds
> are they had high end neurological evaluation.  (The cardiology  
> evaluation
> of my patient had been first class, the patient just made bad  
> choices.)
>
> The remarkable thing was that, after the "treatments" the previous 2  
> days,
> the family agreed that the patient (who had reportedly not been out  
> of bed
> without a lot of assistance for > 1 year) got up and walked  
> unassisted. Now
> I understand placebo effect, but anyone (regardless of dx except  
> perhaps
> psyc dx) who has not been ambulating for a year suddenly doing so
> independently is pretty remarkable, regardless of dx.
>
> Since that time, I have spoken with MD acupuncturists, Korean and  
> Japanese
> traditional medicine practitioners (usually with a translator) and  
> anyone
> else I found with experience and/or knowledge in the area.  I have  
> become
> fairly convinced that there is far more to acupuncture than sticking  
> needles
> in the right places.  It appears to me that successful  
> acupuncturists have
> some ability to manipulate energy (?Chi? for lack of a better term),  
> and the
> use of a battery connected to the needles just doesn't make up for  
> that
> lack. This "life energy" what the Japanese practitioner told me he
> manipulated with his hands.
>
> Interestingly, I have also been told that some people are "Chi  
> sinks" - i.e.
> can soak up a patient's energy and thus they feel worse after tx, not
> better.  I met one MD who did at least a month in California learning
> acupuncture, and had almost no positive responses, and some patients  
> felt
> worse.  He was indeed a competent physician, based on working in close
> proximity daily for years. He abandoned the use of acupuncture.
>
> It would be really nice to get a better handle on this.  Just  
> because most
> of us can't sense, much less manipulate, this alleged energy doesn't  
> mean it
> doesn't exist and can't be of therapeutic value.
>
>
> Lorick Fox, MPAS, PA-C
> Gianaclis Support Complex
> +20-3-448-2335 or +20-45-240-9450
> Fax +20-45-243-1191
> Mobile +20-18-230-4448
>
>
>
> --
> trauma-list : TRAUMA.ORG
> To change your settings or unsubscribe visit:
> http://www.trauma.org/index.php?/community/ 

--
trauma-list : TRAUMA.ORG
To change your settings or unsubscribe visit:
http://www.trauma.org/index.php?/community/ 

----------------------------------------------------------------------
CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This email communication and any attachments may contain confidential and privileged information for the use of the designated recipients named above. If you are not the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that you have received this communication in error and that any review, disclosure, dissemination, distribution or copying of it or its contents is prohibited. If you have received this communication in error, please reply to the sender immediately or by telephone at (413) 794-0000 and destroy all copies of this communication and any attachments. For further information regarding Baystate Health's privacy policy, please visit our Internet web site at http://www.baystatehealth.com.
--
trauma-list : TRAUMA.ORG
To change your settings or unsubscribe visit:
http://www.trauma.org/index.php?/community/ 

List Archives

For your convenience, find the Trauma List Archive Below

Alternative therapies (OT)