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C-SPINE CLEARANCE - surprise

htaed_rd at 123mail.org htaed_rd at 123mail.org
Sun Aug 23 06:18:12 BST 2009 

And we have come full circle. Some people were shocked that these things
are still being taught. Somebody asked why these things continue to be
taught. Some answers were provided. This kind of response is exactly why
these will continue to be taught.

This is a problem. It does exist. Stating that what is being taught is
not the current standard may make you feel better, but it does nothing
to stop people from teaching nonsense. 

In other words, the lowest common denominator local instructor will
continue to set the guidelines in many places. Passing on whatever
mythology they happen to believe in.

The head of the local EMS organization that teaches PHTLS makes it quite
clear that spinal immobilization is the most important part of trauma
care, when he teaches. If you don't get the patient to look at you
straight out of the window of the car - "You just made him a quad! Game
over."

Tim Noonan.


On Sat, 22 Aug 2009 23:51 -0500, "McSwain, Norman E Jr."
<nmcswai at tulane.edu> wrote:
> unfortunately that is way out of date. too much foot dragging to get out
> a new one. ATLS, PHTLS and BTLS are the current standards for physicians
> and EMTs respectively
>  
> Norman
>  
> Norman McSwain MD
> Trauma Director, Charity Hospital
> Professor of Surgery, Tulane University
> New Orleans LA
> 504 988 5111
> norman.mcswain at tulane.edu <mailto:norman.mcswain at tulane.edu> 
> 
> ________________________________
> 
> From: trauma-list-bounces at trauma.org on behalf of Forrest Robleto
> Sent: Sat 8/22/2009 10:38 PM
> To: Trauma-List [TRAUMA.ORG]
> Subject: Re: C-SPINE CLEARANCE - surprise
> 
> 
> 
> DOT Standard Curriculum
> 
> 
> V/R
> 
> Forrest Robleto, NCEE
> R House Health & Safety
> www.RHouseTraining.com
> FRobleto at RhouseTraining.com
> 609-792-9047
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Pablo
> Picasso<http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/p/pablo_picasso.html>
> - "Computers are useless. They can only give you answers."
> 
> On Sat, Aug 22, 2009 at 5:22 PM, Larry Torrey <ltorrey at maine.rr.com>
> wrote:
> 
> > Standard EMT protocol where?  I didn't think that anything was standard in
> > EMS
> >
> > Not protocol around here.
> >
> > LT
> >
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: Forrest Robleto <farcpr at gmail.com>
> >
> > Date: Sat, 22 Aug 2009 17:08:48
> > To: Trauma-List [TRAUMA.ORG <http://trauma.org/>]<trauma-list at trauma.org>
> > Subject: Re: C-SPINE CLEARANCE - surprise
> >
> >
> > Why is EMS putting  cervical collars on GSW patients?  Standard EMT
> > protocol.
> > Are we hurting more people than we are helping using cervical  collars?
> > From
> > all I've read
> > Are we hurting more people than we are helping using cervical  collars? I
> > hope not but I have no recourse.
> >
> >
> > V/R
> >
> > Forrest Robleto, NCEE
> > R House Health & Safety
> > www.RHouseTraining.com <http://www.rhousetraining.com/>
> > FRobleto at RhouseTraining.com
> > 609-792-9047
> >
> >
> >
> >
> > Marie von Ebner-Eschenbach<
> > http://www.brainyquote.com/quotes/authors/m/marie_von_ebnereschenbac.html>
> >  - "Even a stopped clock is right twice a day."
> >
> > On Sat, Aug 22, 2009 at 4:38 PM, <KMATTOX at aol.com> wrote:
> >
> > > clue
> > >
> > > Why is EMS putting  cervical collars on GSW patients?
> > > Why would ANYONE at ANYTIME and ANYWHERE give a patient with a spinal
> > cord
> > > injury any form of a steroid or apply hypothermia
> > > Are we hurting more people than we are helping using cervical  collars?
> > > Are cervical collars in concept basically flawed
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > In a message dated 8/22/2009 3:22:11 P.M. Central Daylight Time,
> > >  candymsnjd at aol.com writes:
> > >
> > >
> > > K
> > > can you give us a hint? is it that blue dye found in m and  m's?
> > > but seriously, we are all waiting to learn the new information...hope
> >  its
> > > sooner than later
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > -----Original  Message-----
> > > From: KMATTOX at aol.com
> > > To: trauma-list at trauma.org
> > > Sent:  Sat, Aug 22, 2009 1:29 pm
> > > Subject: Re: C-SPINE CLEARANCE -  surprise
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Maybe,   I am  checking out the data, the research, the  publications.
> > >
> > > On at least 5 times in the past, suggestions of the data  that I have
> > seen
> > > has been a massive attack upon those who proposed  it and a running into
> > > obscurity.
> > >
> > > As soon  as the information is solid and truly evidence based, I will
> > share
> > >
> > > it.
> > >
> > > I do remember how much many on this list  tried to assassinate me when I
> > > initially questioned MAST pants,  helicopter use for urban use,
> > interosseus
> > >
> > > infusions, aggressive IV  solutions, hypotensive resuscitation, EC
> > > thoracotomy,
> > > CT vs arteriogram  for aortic injury, and many others.   I have deep
> >  scars
> > > to  prove it.
> > >
> > > k
> > >
> > >
> > > In a message dated 8/22/2009  12:12:53 P.M. Central Standard Time,
> > > andrewj.bowman at gmail.com  writes:
> > >
> > > Wouldn't  it be better for us and the patients we care for  if you
> > > shared the  information now?
> > >
> > > --
> > > trauma-list :  TRAUMA.ORG <http://trauma.org/> <http://trauma.org/>
> > >  To change your settings or unsubscribe  visit:
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> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > --
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> > > To change your settings or unsubscribe  visit:
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> > >
> > >
> > > --
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> >  > To change your settings or unsubscribe visit:
> > > http://www.trauma.org/index.php?/community/
> > >
> > --
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> > To change your settings or unsubscribe visit:
> > http://www.trauma.org/index.php?/community/
> > --
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> > To change your settings or unsubscribe visit:
> > http://www.trauma.org/index.php?/community/
> >
> --
> trauma-list : TRAUMA.ORG
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>

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