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Neuro Obs in ICU
Ian Seppelt SeppelI at wahs.nsw.gov.auWed Sep 13 23:58:01 BST 2006
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A topic close to my heart. GCS is often very poorly assessed, and interindividual difference can be spectacular. It fascinates me to see a previously stable GCS suddenly change by a number of units at the time of a nursing shift handover! A. Central pain needs to be central and specific. By far the best is the supraorbital nerve. Another reasonable site is a trapezius squeeze. The 'sternal rub' is useless, non specific and also disfiguring (how many times have you seen bruising after too many people have done misguided, violent sternal rubs). I threaten to break the arms of any of my own staff I see doing it. Attached find a picture of a patient who had one too many vigorous sternal rubs. The supraorbital nerve is also the only specific way to distinguish between appropriate (M4) and inappropriate flexion (M3) and localisation (M5), depending on whether the hand comes ABOVE the clavicle [need to come above the clavicle to score a 5] B. It is part of your overall neurological assessment of a patient, which includes an examination to rule out spinal cord injury. I have attached the original description of the motor response from Teasdale and Jennett. C. Hourly / 4th hourly GCS is of much less value in a sedated patient. One of the standard 'errors' in APACHE II scoring is to assign a GCS3 to someone deeply sedated and unresponsive (=12 points instantly!). A great way to dishonestly bring down your SMR and one thing I specifically look at when assessing a unit's data during training accreditation inspections. I note your question refers to ongoing GCS assessments in ICU - that is a different animal to a one off assessment in the emergency department, and the reproducibility of ICU observations is paramount (rather than the 'best' response per se) Cheers, Ian Ian Seppelt FANZCA FJFICM Senior Staff Specialist Dept of Intensive Care Medicine The Nepean Hospital, PO Box 63 Penrith NSW 2751 Clinical Lecturer, University of Sydney >>> comascora at hotmail.com 13/09/2006 7:40pm >>> I am a General ICU nurse with just over six years experience in predominately Trauma/neuro intensive care both in Australia and the UK. I am after opinion, current practice/guidelines, or relevant references/evidence for assessment using the Glasgow Coma Score in order to facilitate best practice at my current workplace. Most specifically, A) What is the best site for giving central pain stimulus? B) Is there any true relevance to assessing using peripheral stimulus? Or is it impossible distinguish it from purely a spinal reflex? C) Is it necessary to assess using the GCS (ie give painful stimulus etc, hourly/4th hourly etc), to a sedated patient? Or is pupil assessment the only guide to deterioration once sedation is commenced? Any information is greatly appreciated Brenton _________________________________________________________________ Find your old friends and discover what they're doing now. http://ninemsn.com.au/share/redir/adTrack.asp?mode=click&clientID=389&referral=HM_tagline_SEP06&URL=http://ninemsn.schoolfriends.com.au -- trauma-list : TRAUMA.ORG To change your settings or unsubscribe visit: http://www.trauma.org/traumalist.html ###################################################################### Attention: This message is intended for the addresses named and may contain confidential information. If you are not the intended recipient, please delete it and notify the sender. Views expressed in this message are those of the individual sender, and are not necessarily the views of Sydney West Area Health Service. This e-mail has been scanned for viruses ###################################################################### -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: GCS JAMA 2004.pdf Type: application/pdf Size: 42741 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://list.mistral.net/pipermail/trauma-list/attachments/20060914/fecf72c8/GCSJAMA2004-0001.pdf -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Sternal rub small photo.JPG Type: image/jpeg Size: 80957 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://list.mistral.net/pipermail/trauma-list/attachments/20060914/fecf72c8/Sternalrubsmallphoto-0001.jpg -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: Teasdale and Jennett motor responses.jpg Type: image/jpeg Size: 182050 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://list.mistral.net/pipermail/trauma-list/attachments/20060914/fecf72c8/TeasdaleandJennettmotorresponses-0001.jpg -------------- next part -------------- A non-text attachment was scrubbed... Name: GCS scoring.doc Type: application/msword Size: 20480 bytes Desc: not available Url : http://list.mistral.net/pipermail/trauma-list/attachments/20060914/fecf72c8/GCSscoring-0001.doc
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