List Archives

Wed, 12 Jun 2002 07:39:37 -0300

Dear Dave,=20

Your response as I interpret it is no, i.e. there are no random
breathalyzers. The rationale you cite is based on faulty law not =
medicine
nor good sense. Random "smelling" is not the same as random testing.

	"Reporting to work while under the influence is certainly an
exercise of
> bad judgment."  =20
>=20
Although alcohol is legal with in limits, it is more than bad judgment =
to be
drunk on the job. You departmental standards and your defense of them
demonstrate a distinct lack of appreciation of the danger to the =
public. The
issue is not the laws, but a failure of rational response to the most =
common
intoxicant threat to public well being from alcohol.

Yours truly
Tom
> ----------
> From: 	Dave Adler EMT-P[SMTP:daveadler_emtp@msn.com]
> Reply To: 	trauma-list@trauma.org
> Sent: 	Quarta-feira, 12 de Junho de 2002 02:41
> To: 	trauma-list@trauma.org
> Subject: 	RE: Drug (ab)use in Medicine?
>=20
> Since you asked- if I smell alcohol on one of my officers, I can =
order a
> breathalyzer per policy.  If it's positive, he'll certainly be
> suspended, and possibly fired.  If he's been driving, and he's over =
the
> limit he'll be charged.
>=20
> However, it's important to draw a distinction here- alcohol is legal.
> Reporting to work while under the influence is certainly an exercise =
of
> bad judgment.  Marijuana is illegal, and possessing or using it isn't
> simply bad judgment it's a crime.  Big difference.
>=20
> Dave Adler, EMT-P
> Editor, Prehospital Perspective Magazine
> www.prehospital-perspective.com
> adler@prehospital-perspective.com=20
> =20
> =20
>=20
> > -----Original Message-----
> > From: trauma-list-admin@trauma.org
> [mailto:trauma-list-admin@trauma.org]
> > On Behalf Of Thomas Anthony Horan
> > Sent: Tuesday, June 11, 2002 6:37 AM
> > To: 'trauma-list@trauma.org'
> > Subject: RE: Drug (ab)use in Medicine?
> >=20
> > Dear Dave
> >=20
> > Does your department also do random breathalyzers on officers and =
are
> the
> > occasional positive tests followed by instant dismissal no =
questions
> > asked?
> >=20
> > Tom Horan
> >=20
> > > ----------
> > > From: 	Dave Adler EMT-P[SMTP:daveadler_emtp@msn.com]
> > > Reply To: 	trauma-list@trauma.org
> > > Sent: 	Ter=E7a-feira, 11 de Junho de 2002 02:05
> > > To: 	trauma-list@trauma.org
> > > Subject: 	RE: Drug (ab)use in Medicine?
> > >
> > > Andrew wrote: Never seen anybody injured while fighting with a =
man
> on
> > > marijuana, or anyone killed by a man driving his car while =
'stoned'.
> > > Seen thousands of people injured or killed because of alcohol. =
Lets
> get
> > > that into perspective!!
> > >
> > > Andy,
> > >
> > > I want to move to wherever you live.  Here, I see those two =
things
> > > weekly, some weeks daily.
> > >
> > > I've made 30 or so DUI arrests this year (I'm a full-time police
> > > sergeant in Philadelphia).  In 13 of those cases, marijuana has =
been
> the
> > > intoxicant.  Of those 13, 5 have involved accidents with =
injuries.
> You
> > > don't even want to know the number of assaults I've handled where
> > > marijuana has been a factor.
> > >
> > > The notion that marijuana is a harmless, or less-harmful, drug is =
a
> > > fallacy.
> > >
> > > Of course, all other arguments aside, there is one that is
> irrefutable.
> > > Marijuana is illegal in my neck of the woods.  Those in a =
position
> of
> > > public trust cannot fail to abide by the law and expect to =
maintain
> > > their positions.  By way of example, if you get caught using in =
my
> > > service (and we do frequent, random drug testing) you're fired.  =
No
> > > questions asked.  Not to mention that a conviction for a drug
> offense
> > > can cost someone their license/certification.
> > >
> > >
> > > Dave Adler, EMT-P
> > > Editor, Prehospital Perspective Magazine
> > > www.prehospital-perspective.com
> > > adler@prehospital-perspective.com
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > > From: trauma-list-admin@trauma.org
> > > [mailto:trauma-list-admin@trauma.org]
> > > > On Behalf Of andrew frazer
> > > > Sent: Sunday, June 09, 2002 3:30 PM
> > > > To: trauma-list@trauma.org
> > > > Subject: Re: Drug (ab)use in Medicine?
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > >From: "Cotton, Chris (SAAS)" <cotton.chris@saambulance.com.au>
> > > > >Reply-To: trauma-list@trauma.org
> > > > >To: "'trauma-list@trauma.org'" <trauma-list@trauma.org>
> > > > >Subject: Drug (ab)use in Medicine?
> > > > >Date: Sun, 9 Jun 2002 16:11:07 +0930
> > > > >
> > > > >......... I turn the lights off, light some incense, stoke my
> pipe
> > > and
> > > > I'm
> > > > >taken on a musical journey for an hour. Hey - it works for
> > > > me.............
> > > > >
> > > > >Chris - just what do you put in that pipe?   :)
> > > > >
> > > > >John
> > > > >
> > > > >Dr John L Holmes
> > > > >Director Emergency Medicine
> > > > >Mater Hospitals, Brisbane, Australia
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >Hmmmm, i could give the boring answer, or one that might
> stimulate
> > > some
> > > > >discussion, and perhaps even debate. I do this not necessarily =
as
> an
> > > > >advocate of what follows, but in the interest of seeing how =
other
> > > trauma
> > > > >players view the topic. We can be lame and ignore it, or we =
can
> look
> > > at
> > > > it
> > > > >and discuss it.
> > > > >
> > > > >Hypothetically, suppose i said it was marijuana that i put in =
the
> > > pipe;
> > > > and
> > > > >that i did it because i found it stimulating to my musical =
ear,
> it
> > > > >increased
> > > > >my clarity of thought and i enjoyed the sensation of being =
mildly
> > > stoned
> > > > >OCCASIONALLY? Would one cite studies that categorically denied
> that
> > > this
> > > > >might be a desireable side effect in some people?
> > > > >
> > > > >Would people start immediately citing references to studies =
that
> > > showed
> > > > the
> > > > >deleterious effects of the drug? Would they then also do the =
same
> for
> > > PDI
> > > > >inhibitors like caffeine, or other epidemiological studies =
that
> > > showed
> > > > the
> > > > >effects of alcohol and tobacco and their impacts on society?
> > > > >
> > > > >Would one then dare ask how many EMS workers use marijuana (or
> other
> > > > drugs)
> > > > >occasionally, and how many of them may infact have spent =
longer
> in
> > > the
> > > > job
> > > > >because they employed a behaviour that helped them take time =
out
> from
> > > > their
> > > > >jobs occasionally and gave them "stress relief" perhaps. Their
> > > equivalent
> > > > >of
> > > > >the Theatre, gardening or a concert perhaps?
> > > > >
> > > > >Remember that this is only hypothetical, so please don't shoot
> the
> > > > >messenger
> > > > >for asking legitimate questions and bringing up discussion =
that
> > > examines
> > > > >drug use by EMS workers. I know a lot of people in the EMS
> industry
> > > who
> > > > do
> > > > >use different drugs, both legitimate and illicit occasionally.
> > > > >Understanding
> > > > >what they use and a having a responsible attitude to their =
use,
> in
> > > their
> > > > >eyes does not necessarily correlate as an issue for most of =
them.
> > > > >
> > > > >Regards,
> > > > >Chris Cotton
> > > > >Intensive Care Paramedic.
> > > > >
> > > > >
> > > > >--
> > > > >trauma-list : TRAUMA.ORG
> > > > >To change your settings or unsubscribe visit:
> > > > >http://www.trauma.org/traumalist.html
> > > >
> > > >
> > > > Never seen anybody injured while fighting with a man on =
marijuana,
> or
> > > > anyone
> > > > killed by a man driving his car while 'stoned'. Seen thousands =
of
> > > people
> > > > injured or killed because of alcohol. Lets get that into
> perspective!!
> > > >
> > > > Andy. (Not a user!) Casualty Nurse.
> > > >
> > > > =
_________________________________________________________________
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> > > >
> > > > --
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> > >
> > > --
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> > >
> >=20
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>=20
> --
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>=20

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